De Rode Duivels
Re: De Rode Duivels
Hij kende het reglement goed. Had gewoon Lombaerts erbij moeten houden, Kabasele laten meetrainen als "superreserve", en als hij tegen 12/6 niet fit geraakt was, Lombaerts eruit en Kabasele erin...
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Clubpolska
- Sleutelspeler
- Berichten: 2631
- Lid geworden op: 30 mei 2016, 07:16
- Locatie: Kluisbergen!
Re: De Rode Duivels
Mocht Lombaerts nu werkelijke 100 % fit zijn zou Willy hem toch altijd houden? Er moet iets meer zijn.Bosko schreef: Lombaerts is de klos. Fit maar mag thuis blijven voor jongens als Denayer, Ciman, Kabasele en Boyata.
Oh Frail.
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rambopirou
- A-kern
- Berichten: 645
- Lid geworden op: 29 mei 2016, 22:54
Re: De Rode Duivels
Belgium's golden generation being held back by their own manager Marc Wilmots
Article by
Miguel Delaney
Belgium have some of the best players at Euro 2016, writes Miguel Delaney, so why aren't the performing like it?
A few weeks ago, Jan Vertonghen was in one of Tottenham Hotspur’s training-ground meeting rooms and enthusing about his supreme centre-half partnership with compatriot Toby Alderweireld - but also explaining how it’s unlikely to make any difference to Belgian manager Marc Wilmots at Euro 2016.
[EURO 2016 TEAM PROFILES: BELGIUM]
“I don’t expect him to try us together, no,” Vertonghen said with stark matter-of-factness. “I think we’ll start the campaign as full-backs and you never know where you’re going to end up but hopefully we stay full-backs, because otherwise that will mean more injuries.” In other words, it’s going to take a crisis for Wilmots to try two of the Premier League and Belgium’s better players in their best positions. It is actually remarkable. Wilmots has ready-prepared understanding in a key area, of the sort that would greatly improve any team and so many managers would crave, but refuses to use it.
It sums up the big issue with this Belgian team, before even getting as far as their real stars. As you look down that eye-opening squad list, after all, it’s very difficult not to be impressed at the sheer variety of brilliance; it’s almost impossible not to think they could win it. The problem, though, is that Wilmots evidently doesn’t look at it in the same way. In his time as manager, Belgium have been a team who are less than the sum of their sensational individual parts. It is a greater obstacle to their chance at glory than any opposition side - unless Wilmots is building to something no-one else sees, or is willing to change. The only thing building right now is the fear that the wrong manager could waste a golden generation. Belgium are just so frustratingly flat in a way they shouldn't be. They just don’t spark or flow in the way a team of such fine ability should, and there are head-scratching decisions right through the team. Nothing emphasises any of this more than the fact that the player with the most international goals in this squad is not Eden Hazard or Kevin De Bruyne or any of the other brilliant attackers, but Marouane Fellaini, with 15. Despite all the quality in the Belgium side, he is the player that Wilmots has described as “unique”. Whatever that means in the context of Fellaini, resorting to the Manchester United man is often the manager’s only tactical solution if games aren’t going their way. Fellaini may not start, but he will usually be brought on so the team can avail of his physical force, as was the case in the 2-1 World Cup win over Algeria.
Belgium are usually in that kind of frustrating situation, though, because they’re not maximising superior players. Hazard and De Bruyne are two of the most entertaining and effective free-wheeling attackers in the game when on form but, under Wilmots, it is like they are on rigid tram lines. Behind them, Mousa Dembele can’t get in the team ahead of Axel Witsel despite his evolution into one of the best midfielders in the Premier League, but that’s still not as surprising as the decision with his Spurs team-mates Vertonghen and Alderweireld. Wilmots will use 20-year-old Jason Denayer - on loan at Galatasaray from Manchester City - and Zenit St Petersburg’s Nic Lombaerts in such a crucial area, rather than one of the best partnerships in Europe. It just comes across as the manager almost second-guessing himself, or seeing a vision that has not been apparent on the pitch yet. Wilmots uses Alderweireld and Vertongthen in the full-back positions because of how their styles theoretically give the team a greater cohesion. If that cohesion is evidently not there in reality, though, what is the cost of restoring them to their best places? It’s such an oddly confounding issue; something that seems so obvious but evidently isn’t to the manager. To give him his due, however, Wilmots has undeniably built cohesion in another way. Virtually every player feels the manager creates a great spirit and atmosphere around the squad, and that can be as important to a tournament as deeper tactical integration. Even if they were underwhelming in Brazil, too, the feeling was that the mere experience of that first tournament together will foster an evolution in this campaign.
Thibaut Courtois has certainly bought into his manager’s approach in that regard, hinting at this deeper unity. “We might have the most quality of the teams in our group but in football it's not always quality that wins games,” he said. “It's about team spirit and fighting for each other and doing your tactical work well.” Courtois came out with that quote this week but it’s almost interchangeable with a line from Wilmots a few months ago: “Everybody wants to play beautiful football but that can't be at the expense of discipline and efficiency, because that’s how you get results.” Wilmots has raised results to a certain level and the kind of qualities cited by Courtois and his coach could yet lift them to a higher one. Belgium will certainly be hard to beat. It’s just that they should find winning so much easier.
Article by
Miguel Delaney
Belgium have some of the best players at Euro 2016, writes Miguel Delaney, so why aren't the performing like it?
A few weeks ago, Jan Vertonghen was in one of Tottenham Hotspur’s training-ground meeting rooms and enthusing about his supreme centre-half partnership with compatriot Toby Alderweireld - but also explaining how it’s unlikely to make any difference to Belgian manager Marc Wilmots at Euro 2016.
[EURO 2016 TEAM PROFILES: BELGIUM]
“I don’t expect him to try us together, no,” Vertonghen said with stark matter-of-factness. “I think we’ll start the campaign as full-backs and you never know where you’re going to end up but hopefully we stay full-backs, because otherwise that will mean more injuries.” In other words, it’s going to take a crisis for Wilmots to try two of the Premier League and Belgium’s better players in their best positions. It is actually remarkable. Wilmots has ready-prepared understanding in a key area, of the sort that would greatly improve any team and so many managers would crave, but refuses to use it.
It sums up the big issue with this Belgian team, before even getting as far as their real stars. As you look down that eye-opening squad list, after all, it’s very difficult not to be impressed at the sheer variety of brilliance; it’s almost impossible not to think they could win it. The problem, though, is that Wilmots evidently doesn’t look at it in the same way. In his time as manager, Belgium have been a team who are less than the sum of their sensational individual parts. It is a greater obstacle to their chance at glory than any opposition side - unless Wilmots is building to something no-one else sees, or is willing to change. The only thing building right now is the fear that the wrong manager could waste a golden generation. Belgium are just so frustratingly flat in a way they shouldn't be. They just don’t spark or flow in the way a team of such fine ability should, and there are head-scratching decisions right through the team. Nothing emphasises any of this more than the fact that the player with the most international goals in this squad is not Eden Hazard or Kevin De Bruyne or any of the other brilliant attackers, but Marouane Fellaini, with 15. Despite all the quality in the Belgium side, he is the player that Wilmots has described as “unique”. Whatever that means in the context of Fellaini, resorting to the Manchester United man is often the manager’s only tactical solution if games aren’t going their way. Fellaini may not start, but he will usually be brought on so the team can avail of his physical force, as was the case in the 2-1 World Cup win over Algeria.
Belgium are usually in that kind of frustrating situation, though, because they’re not maximising superior players. Hazard and De Bruyne are two of the most entertaining and effective free-wheeling attackers in the game when on form but, under Wilmots, it is like they are on rigid tram lines. Behind them, Mousa Dembele can’t get in the team ahead of Axel Witsel despite his evolution into one of the best midfielders in the Premier League, but that’s still not as surprising as the decision with his Spurs team-mates Vertonghen and Alderweireld. Wilmots will use 20-year-old Jason Denayer - on loan at Galatasaray from Manchester City - and Zenit St Petersburg’s Nic Lombaerts in such a crucial area, rather than one of the best partnerships in Europe. It just comes across as the manager almost second-guessing himself, or seeing a vision that has not been apparent on the pitch yet. Wilmots uses Alderweireld and Vertongthen in the full-back positions because of how their styles theoretically give the team a greater cohesion. If that cohesion is evidently not there in reality, though, what is the cost of restoring them to their best places? It’s such an oddly confounding issue; something that seems so obvious but evidently isn’t to the manager. To give him his due, however, Wilmots has undeniably built cohesion in another way. Virtually every player feels the manager creates a great spirit and atmosphere around the squad, and that can be as important to a tournament as deeper tactical integration. Even if they were underwhelming in Brazil, too, the feeling was that the mere experience of that first tournament together will foster an evolution in this campaign.
Thibaut Courtois has certainly bought into his manager’s approach in that regard, hinting at this deeper unity. “We might have the most quality of the teams in our group but in football it's not always quality that wins games,” he said. “It's about team spirit and fighting for each other and doing your tactical work well.” Courtois came out with that quote this week but it’s almost interchangeable with a line from Wilmots a few months ago: “Everybody wants to play beautiful football but that can't be at the expense of discipline and efficiency, because that’s how you get results.” Wilmots has raised results to a certain level and the kind of qualities cited by Courtois and his coach could yet lift them to a higher one. Belgium will certainly be hard to beat. It’s just that they should find winning so much easier.
Re: De Rode Duivels
Onbegrijpelijk. Manmanman. Amateurisme tot en met.
Re: De Rode Duivels
Gisterenmiddag zei Willy dat Lombaerts weliswaar terug traint, maar nog niet met de groep had meegetraind, en dat hij 5 weken niet gespeeld heeft. De definitieve beslissing over eventuele afvallende verdedigers en het opvissen van Lombaerts zou volgens hem morgen (10 juni) worden genomen (http://www.nieuwsblad.be/cnt/dmf20160608_02329498" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;).Clubpolska schreef:Mocht Lombaerts nu werkelijke 100 % fit zijn, zou Willy hem toch altijd houden? Er moet iets meer zijn.Bosko schreef: Lombaerts is de klos. Fit maar mag thuis blijven voor jongens als Denayer, Ciman, Kabasele en Boyata.
Bijzonder vreemd, aangezien een geblesseerde speler bij mijn weten nog tot (volgens andere bronnen tot en met) 12 juni vervangen kan worden. Je wacht toch gewoon best zo lang mogelijk om de evaluatie te maken of iemand uit je selectie al dan niet moet vervangen worden?
En dat is inderdaad al de tweede vreemde beslissing, nadat hij Lombaerts verving door Kabasele. Hier hetzelfde argument: waarom niet afwachten tot 12 juni om te beoordelen of Lombaerts al dan niet mee kan? Als er op dat moment twijfels waren, kon hij toch altijd Kabasele al bij de groep halen als reserve? Lombaerts zit nu ook nog bij de groep. Indien dan tegen 12 juni zou gebleken zijn dat het niet goed komt met Nicolas, dan kon Kabasele altijd nog 'officieel' bij de kern worden gevoegd...
De kans was/is misschien niet groot dat Lombaerts nog (wedstrijd)fit raakt om nog een rol van betekenis te kunnen spelen op het EK, maar hij is, zeker in afwezigheid van Kompany, toch een belangrijke speler.
Re: De Rode Duivels
Nu even om advocaat van de duivel te spelen, het is nu niet dat het tegen Noorwegen zoveel beter was met hun 2 centraal. Ofwel zijn je backs kwetsbaar, ofwel je centrum...
Ciman-Alderweireld-Vermaelen-Vertongen lijkt me het beste momenteel. ( Nooit gedacht dat ik Ciman in dat rijtje ging zetten)
Denayer is me twee keer tegengevallen.
Ciman-Alderweireld-Vermaelen-Vertongen lijkt me het beste momenteel. ( Nooit gedacht dat ik Ciman in dat rijtje ging zetten)
Denayer is me twee keer tegengevallen.
Re: De Rode Duivels
Heeft hij dat echt gezegd dat Lombaerts al vijf weken niet gespeeld heeft?
Vermaelen had sinds maart niet meer gespeeld vooraleer hij naar de Duivels kwam.
Boyata speelde geen match meer sinds half april.
Vermaelen had sinds maart niet meer gespeeld vooraleer hij naar de Duivels kwam.
Boyata speelde geen match meer sinds half april.
Re: De Rode Duivels
Willy Wanka strikes again
"Those who were dancing were thought to be stupid by those that could not hear the music."
Do what thou wilt, shall be the whole of the law.
Do what thou wilt, shall be the whole of the law.
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fcb 4 life
- Sleutelspeler
- Berichten: 3930
- Lid geworden op: 30 mei 2016, 13:44
- Locatie: Gistel
Re: De Rode Duivels
Italië is mss te vroeg maar Meunier maakt toch meer kans op een basisplaats op dit EK dan een Ciman?
Ik durf er niet aan te denken dat Ciman heel dat EK zal spelen als Alderweireld tenminste centraal zal staan.
Ik durf er niet aan te denken dat Ciman heel dat EK zal spelen als Alderweireld tenminste centraal zal staan.
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WesthoekUnited
- Belofte
- Berichten: 205
- Lid geworden op: 30 mei 2016, 11:47
- Locatie: Westhoek
Re: De Rode Duivels
.IsO schreef:Gisterenmiddag zei Willy dat Lombaerts weliswaar terug traint, maar nog niet met de groep had meegetraind,Clubpolska schreef:Mocht Lombaerts nu werkelijke 100 % fit zijn, zou Willy hem toch altijd houden? Er moet iets meer zijn.Bosko schreef: Lombaerts is de klos. Fit maar mag thuis blijven voor jongens als Denayer, Ciman, Kabasele en Boyata.en dat hij 5 weken niet gespeeld heeft
Als dit 1 van de hoofdredenen is, wat doet Vermaelen dan in de selectie?
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fcb 4 life
- Sleutelspeler
- Berichten: 3930
- Lid geworden op: 30 mei 2016, 13:44
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Re: De Rode Duivels
15-0 
Re: De Rode Duivels
1-0 en met knikkende knieën zeker?
Re: De Rode Duivels
Meunier -- Alderweireld -- Lombaerts -- Vertonghen
Dit zou de verdediging voor mij moeten zijn!
Dit zou de verdediging voor mij moeten zijn!
Re: De Rode Duivels
Logica van Wilmots eh :geenhupWesthoekUnited schreef:.IsO schreef:Gisterenmiddag zei Willy dat Lombaerts weliswaar terug traint, maar nog niet met de groep had meegetraind,Clubpolska schreef:Mocht Lombaerts nu werkelijke 100 % fit zijn, zou Willy hem toch altijd houden? Er moet iets meer zijn.Bosko schreef: Lombaerts is de klos. Fit maar mag thuis blijven voor jongens als Denayer, Ciman, Kabasele en Boyata.en dat hij 5 weken niet gespeeld heeft
Als dit 1 van de hoofdredenen is, wat doet Vermaelen dan in de selectie?